Illegal ILD Traffic - Infocomm penalty case

[city02 63]

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/869836.cms

RAJESHWARI ADAPPA THAKUR

MUMBAI: Bharat Sanchar Nigam (BSNL) is embroiled in a dispute with Reliance Infocomm. It has accused the Reliance group’s telecom arm of tampering with the country codes of incoming international calls so as to save on the Access Deficit Charges (ADC) that it would have to pay to BSNL for international long distance (ILD) calls.

According to market sources, BSNL is said to have even disconnected the point of interconnect (PoI) at Ahmedabad about 10 days ago. Connectivity was restored only after Reliance Info paid a penalty of Rs 1 crore. But this could not be verified. In fact, BSNL is now threatening to disconnect other PoIs with Reliance Infocomm. BSNL is also said to have issued a notice to Reliance in this regard.

ET sent a questionnaire to Reliance Infocomm on Monday, but failed to get a formal response from the private sector telecom company till late Thursday evening.

BSNL sources claimed that apart from the loss of revenue, the alleged tampering of the caller line identification (CLI) could also impact the country’s security since it will be difficult to trace these calls. When contacted, both BSNL and Reliance officials refused to comment on the subject.

Sources close to Reliance denied that any disconnection had taken place and said that no fine or penalty had been paid. “If there had been disconnection, then calls between Reliance and BSNL and vice versa would not have happened,” pointed out these sources.

PS:

I noticed this a few days ago when I got an international call from north america with a 5 digit caller ID!

[Arun 795]

The Hindu Business Line - September 30, 2004

BHARAT Sanchar Nigam Ltd has threatened to pull the plug off Reliance Infocomm's international long distance network for allegedly carrying illegal traffic on its network. BSNL is understood to have disconnected Reliance's point of interconnection in Ahmedabad a few weeks ago because of this.

Senior BSNL officials confirmed that the matter was being taken up with Reliance at the State level wherever discrepancies were found. "It has been found that Reliance network was being used to route illegal ILD calls at various centres across the country. The issue is being taken up by BSNL officers at the local level," said a BSNL official.

However, a Reliance Infocomm spokesperson said that the company was offering services as per licence norms and no illegal activities were being undertaken. "We are not aware of any disconnections. All our points of interconnection with BSNL are working." The spat between Reliance and BSNL has been on for some time now. Earlier, Reliance had blamed the state-owned company of purposely denying interconnection, which was putting off the former's rollout plans.

BSNL disconnects Reliance Infocomm's POI in Ahmedabad

Mumbai, Sep 30 : State-owned telephony major Bharat Sanchar Nigam Ltd (BSNL) has disconnected Reliance Infocomm Ltd's Point of Interconnect (PoI) in Ahmedabad, citing movement of "illegal traffic" through the POI.

The Public Sector Undertaking is also seeking a penalty of Rs one crore from Reliance Infocomm, stating losses due to "illegal routing of international traffic" through the PoI, top BSNL officials told PTI here today.

The POI was disconnected early this week and whether Reliance has footed the penalty could not be ascertained, he said adding, details are yet to reach the incumbent's Delhi office.

Meanwhile, industry sources said BSNL had taken the issue to Telecom Regulatory Authority of India which had subsequently forwarded it to Department of Telecommunications, whose decision is awaited.

BSNL is also planning to undertake random checks at Reliance Infocomm's PoIs at other places in the country to check whether such illegal traffic is taking place through other POIs, they said.

This would be done at the district levels of the state-owned company, they said.

Meanwhile, Reliance Infocomm officials denied the termination of the POI, saying "we are not aware of any such moves".

Minor issues on inter-connectivity, Access Deficit Charges occur, which would also be settled after talks, they said. PTI

[Code 0]

Even me got similar one - I thought it was simply a CLIP bug

[Ganesh 0]

reliance have become careful.today i received an overseas call with correct cli number.before it used to be some irrelevant number

[Chirag 5]

I had recd an overseas call to my Landline(MTNL) some days back. The incoming no was an Indian GSM no. I assumed that it could be coz the person was using a Calling Card or Net2Phone or something... Any idea on this?

[ragha_shenoy 0]

I am attaching a report by TOI on RIC's malpractices. I would like to ask everyone on this forum.Is this what we want from Reliance?

VADODARA/RAJKOT: The Bharat Sanchar Nigam Limited (BSNL) has unearthed a malpractice in which Reliance Infocom Limited (RIL) was found to be converting international calls into STD, eventually paying less inter-connect usage (IUC) charges to BSNL.

BSNL chief general manager, Gujarat, A K Bhandari told TNN, “RIL was re-routing its international calls through the national trunk group. Notices were issued to RIL to which it has responded.

Investigations in other districts of Gujarat including Surat, Valsad, Rajkot and Vadodara had brought to light such cases.” While the Ahmedabad Telecom District alone claimed penalty of almost Rs 1 crore, the Vadodara circle has sent notices of about Rs 2.25 crore.

BSNL general manager at Rajkot, A L Patel, while admitting to a loss of around 20 crore, said, “A four-member team had been asked to inquire into the case.” He, however, refused to give out the name of the members. “First, records for the last three months will be verified followed by records in the last one-and-a-half year. Not just RIL, but BSNL Rajkot would look into the calls made by the other operators also,” he said. Joint deputy director general, BSNL, Mahipal Singh, has asked all chief general managers to monitor the entire incoming traffic from all private operators.

The malpractice came to light after a BSNL user in Ahmedabad complained that though he was receiving calls from US and Canada, the common line identification (CLI) number being flashed on his mobile was either from Mumbai or Chennai. The user also specified that his relatives in the US were using RIL’s prepaid card.

The Sanchar Nigam Executive Association (SNEA) found that the CLI was being manipulated to route the international calls so that the interconnect usage charges (IUC) to BSNL were lesser.

Authorities at BSNL headquarters, Ahmedabad, had then issued a notice of penalty to RIL, warning disconnection, on September 13, 2004. RIL was asked to respond within a given time, which it did not, and BSNL disconnected them on September 22.

Later, RIL wrote to the Department of Telecommunication (DOT), assuring payment of the due amount, following which the point of interconnect was restarted.

Said circle secretary of SNEA, Gujarat, B G Patel, “While the proposed penalty for major districts has been fixed between Rs 50 lakh and 1.25 crore, an amount between Rs 20 lakh and Rs 50 lakh has been proposed for minor districts.”

A letter from RIL, signed by Dr A Shankar, to the secretary of Department of Telecommunications (DOT), New Delhi, states that RIL is keeping transparent records of all calls and the same can be verified with the call records of BSNL. Hence there would be no problem in arriving at the stipulated amount to be paid to BSNL.

[Basant 0]

It is well documented by Arun Shourie, Gurumurthy etc. how Ambani empire is built on manupulation and fraud. This is what RIM customers have been experiancing for past one year. So the news of Reliance manupulating call records to avoid paying IUC is no surprise to us.

As it has happened in past, nothing would happen to Reliance in this case becoz of its power and deep pockets.

My GOD bless India.....................

[Beetle 0]

Ya. How about the calling cards and Voip based companys. Do they have to pay access deficit charges. Are there any restrictions on Indian Telecom companys preventing them from using VOIP gateway to by pass ADCs.?

Calls from some VOIP based companies in US appear 000000 as the calling number..!!!

[city02 63]

got another call from canada with 001-xxxx CLID (now its 7 digits)...

[city02 63]

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/872544.cms

MANOJ GAIROLA

NEW DELHI: In good old days, smuggling of gold and other precious metals would invariably catch everyone’s imagination.

But in today’s globalised and networked world, it is more lucrative to illegally connect millions from different parts of the world. The size of the market for smuggled telephone calls into India is estimated to be between Rs 3,000 crore - Rs 4,000 crore per annum!

The country’s major private telecom operators are suspected to be involved in this exercise. Recently, United Telecom of Nepal, a joint venture between MTNL, TCIL and VSNL, reported that all the calls to Nepal originating from the networks of Reliance, Bharti and Hutch were being transmitted through the grey market route.

In last two months, the DoT has raided premises of more than 100 small operators who were involved in grey market activities by setting up illegal exchanges. However, it has not yet taken any action against large operators.

The economics of grey market operations is very simple. For international calls, the operators have to pay an access deficit charge (ADC) of Rs 4.25 per minute to the government. The grey market operators do not pay any cess to the government.

The modus operandi of the small grey operators goes as follows. Big international operators like AT&T and MCI sell ISD phone minutes to resellers in the US and other countries.

It is a very competitive market for the resellers as they compete among themselves and with the big operators for customers. They offer very attractive rates to the customers. Such rates are possible only if they have tie-ups with illegal exchange operators in India.

For the illegal exchange operator in India, the cost of operations are very small. Generally, the Indian operator installs a satellite dish antenna and receives illegal ILD calls through it. Then through routers he routes the calls to their destinations.

The illegal operator pays only the local call rate for terminating the call. In the process, the legal ILD operators lose revenues on the incoming calls.

For large operators, driving the grey market is even more easy. They have to simply suppress caller line identification (CLI) and pass on the calls as local calls.

A leading Indian telecom operator is offering calls to India from the USA at 11.99 cents per minute. The termination charge and ADC for an ILD call is Rs 4.55 (or 9.8 cents), toll free cost to the US subscriber is 2 cents per minute. This adds to 11.8 cents.

Therefore, a call should be priced at 11.8 cents plus transportation cost. An average call from the USA should cost between 14-15 cents. A price of 11.99 cents appears to be below cost. Such a price is not possible without grey market operations.

[zeus 0]

I got two calls from US of A ... both 5 digit nos ... ?

[jusmail 0]

CALL DETAILS MUST BE SUBMITTED THIS WEEK

ILD call routing: Govt sets deadline for Reliance Info

PRACHI VERMA

Posted online: Monday, October 11, 2004 at 0000 hours IST

NEW DELHI:

The government has given time till the third week of October to Reliance Infocomm

for submitting details on its international long distance (ILD) calls, which were

terminated on Bharat Sanchar Nigam Ltd’s (BSNL) network.

According to an official in the department of telecommunications (DoT), information

is being sought on whether the case falls under the purview of the government.

“If it is an interconnection issue, the government would not interfere....the two

operators will have to resolve the issue between themselves. The government will

intervene only if it is a violation of licence agreement,” the official said. “The

picture will be clear in a few days,” he added.

“We will wait and watch. Our decision will depend on what explanation is given by

the operator in question. Depending on this, a techno-legal action will be taken,”

the official said.

DoT is also closely tracking other operators on the issue of licence agreements,

according to sources.

Meanwhile, BSNL officials have indicated that the PSU will resolve the matter internally

with Reliance Infocomm. Reliance Infocomm has agreed to pay up the dues to BSNL for

routing the ILD calls as local calls on the PSU’s network.

BSNL had earlier asked the government and the regulator to help stop illegal routing

of ILD calls by some operators including Reliance, on its network.

[Arun 795]

BSNL-Reliance Info spat has a security angle too - The Hindu Business Line

IS the Bharat Sanchar Nigam Ltd-Reliance Infocomm issue merely a bilateral one between the two parties to be settled by themselves, or is it a matter to be pursued by the Department of Telecommunications or other authorities?

Officials, both at BSNL and across the telecom industry, hold differing views. One senior official with one of the BSNL circles which had alleged that Reliance Infocomm was passing off international calls as originating from India itself said: "It is a breach of agreement between them and us."

According to him, since the means of dealing with the problem (namely, disconnecting Reliance's points of interconnect) were in BSNL's hands, and BSNL would also stand to lose less than Reliance Infocomm should the disconnections actually be carried out, it having the larger network of the two, the matter can be settled between the two parties.

However, not everyone at BSNL agrees with him. Senior officials at some of the other circles of BSNL issue feel it is not just a question of BSNL standing to lose revenues, but that the issue is one of security and of violation of license conditions as well.

"Very often law-enforcing agencies want to trace calls. One should see how they persist with us when they want to track down a call. Now, if a call originating from elsewhere showed up as coming from India itself, it would remain untraceable, and law enforcing agencies are not going to like that," said a senior official with a BSNL circle who feels that either the Department of Telecommunications or some other authority ought to pursue the matter more seriously.

Other telecom officials who hold the `bilateral issue' point of view, feel that when voice over Internet protocol telephony (VoIP telephony) is allowed in ILD (provided it is not through a PSTN line), calls will be untraceable anyway, and it would be irrelevant to bring in a security angle to the issue. And as such, it would end up being a bilateral issue between BSNL and Reliance Infocomm.

But BSNL officials want the security angle to be examined too. They point attention to an August news release of this year from the Ministry of Telecommunications: "With a view to curbing the menace of grey Internet telephony market and to check flourishing of illegal telephone exchanges in the country, the Department of Telecom (DoT) has decided to recover the revenue losses by imposing penalty against Internet Service Providers (ISPs) whose Internet leased lines were found being misused."

Reliance Infocomm's case is different from the above one, pointed out a BSNL official. "However, one would note that the DoT is imposing its own penalty and not asking the ILD operators who are the wronged party to settle the issue with the ISPs. So why should ours be only a bilateral issue?"

[Arun 795]

Press Trust of India

New Delhi, October 8

One person has been arrested for running an illegal telephone exchange at village Palam, police said today.

The exchange, busted by a team of officials from the Department of Telecom, the Delhi Police and Reliance Infocomm, was distributing international calls in and around Delhi. It was "Prime Net Global" which was running an Internet leased line of 512 kbps in a illegal manner, an official release said.

The exchange was bringing incoming international call traffic through internet leased line and muturing the call to the party by using high tech equipment and locally dialling and switching through. This presented the international call to the party as a local call.

"Thus this presented the international call to the called party as local call, while actually the called party was speaking to calling party internationally," the release said.

The internet leased line of 512 kbps used in the illegal set up pertained to Prime Net Global, while the domestic numbers (23 in all) used for local dialing pertained to Reliance Infocom.

Prepaid cards available abroad were the main source of the illegal incoming international traffic and were being pushed into the racket in collusion with some foreigners.

The accused, Sanjeev Solanki, has been arrested under the Indian Telegraph Act, and investigations are on to find out the involvement of any other Indian or foreign partner, police said.

Calls received through such kind of setups suffer from lot of noise and the quality of speech is also not good. There is delay in the speech transitions between the parties at both ends.

[Sanay 0]

Illegal telephony thrives in India

By Indrajit Basu

KOLKATA - Two weeks back, India's Bharat Sanchar Nigam Ltd (BSNL), the state-owned telecom service provider and the country's largest telecom operator, made a stunning allegation. It said Reliance Infocomm, the telecom subsidiary of the famous Reliance group, which claims to be the country's fastest-growing wireless telephony service provider, has been cheating BSNL by passing off international calls as local ones to avoid paying it the access deficit charge (ADC).

BSNL alleged that Reliance Infocomm - which runs its wireless integrated telecom service under the Reliance India Mobile (RIM) banner - tweaked its switches so that the caller identification devices of RIM's international long-distance calls looked like local calls at about 50 interconnect points - BSNL owns these points that connect operators throughout the country. Reliance has about 400 interconnect points with BSNL. In the process, said BSNL, Reliance Infocomm evaded ADC worth Rs1.2 billion ($26 million).

Reliance officials say those calls were part of its collect-call service called "home country direct service" and since such calls did not involve three parties - Reliance Infocomm, a foreign operator and BSNL - Reliance Infocomm wasn't breaking any law as ADC is required to be paid only when these three parties are involved. Although investigations are still under way and it is too early to ascertain who's right, this episode reinforces what many have believed for a long time: There's a thriving illegal telephony market in India.

Ever since international long-distance (ILD) telephony was removed from the ambit of state monopoly with the divestment of India's erstwhile sole ILD operator - Videsh Sanchar Nigam Ltd (VSNL) - to the Tatas (one of country's largest industrial groups) about two years back, the ILD arena is getting increasingly messy. Over the past 10 months, the Telecom Vigilance Department has unearthed at least six illegal telephone exchanges across the country, which instead of hooking on to the normal telephony route via the BSNL-owned international gateway, has set up a parallel line using dedicated lease lines, satellites and ISDN (integrated subscriber digital network). The calls are received at the illegal exchanges using gadgets such as multiplexers and dialers and sent to mobile phones.

According to the country's Department of Telecom, apart from cheating the government of its revenue, illegal exchanges pose a security threat. A recent Interpol report said illegal exchanges have possibly helped those involved in drug and human trafficking, gunrunning and money laundering. This was evident in countries such as Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan, which have seen a rapid increase in organized crime in recent years, the report said.

Experts say the fault lies not in the system, but with the telecom regulatory regime that has formulated a few lopsided and outdated polices. For instance, under the present ADC regime - perhaps the sorest point with private telecom operators - telecom companies need to shell out a hefty portion of what they earn, to fund BSNL. While this amount is large enough for long-distance calls within the country (about 60 paise on calls for which companies charge Rs2.50 per minute), it gets worse for international calls. Here, the companies have to pay BSNL Rs4.25 per minute on calls that cost Rs8-10. Given that the total value of international calls is in the region of $1.5 billion a year, it's hardly surprising that private operators are tempted not to declare these calls to BSNL at all.

The question that now arises is why ADC exists at all? This is a concept enunciated by a Telecom Regulatory Authority of India (TRAI) order this year for creating a cross-subsidized system in which relatively high-cost long-distance tariffs are supposed to provide the surpluses in order to enable state-owned telecom companies like BSNL and MTNL offer local fixed-line calls at rates below cost. According to the order, ADC is to be paid only to fixed-line operators (which are all state-owned) since TRAI felt that they alone have been prevented by regulation from recovering costs while other service providers - like wireless phone operators and those offering limited mobility - are not compelled to fix tariffs below cost. The total ADC requirement is estimated at $3 billion annually, the bulk of which (about $2 billion) goes toward subsidizing the monthly rental fee of fixed-line subscribers.

Nevertheless, even as TRAI says that ADC serves a "crucial social cause" - that is, making fixed-line telephony cheaper for state-owned telecom companies that are the only ones that provide telecom services to vast stretches of rural India and hence make telecom affordable to the poorer segments of the population which cannot afford telecom at actual costs - experts say this a "lopsided" rule "whose time and utility is gone". Private operators hold that ADC is "grossly unfair". Says Reliance Infocomm chairman and managing director Mukesh Ambani: "Of a 99-paise call, my subscriber has to pay 80 paise as subsidy. What kind of a model is this? There has to be some public understanding on this."

Many officials of private telecom companies and even some from BSNL admit that illegal telephony in India is inevitable and thrives because of the ADC. "Indeed, it is possible that companies are indulging in such arbitrage on national long-distance calls as well since shelling out a fourth or a fifth of your revenue to a competitor like BSNL is not a very attractive proposition," says a senior official of VSNL, the erstwhile state-owned international call operator that is now controlled by the Tatas.

What also makes such "arbitrage" attractive from a private telecom company's point of view, over and above the financial saving, is the fact that BSNL uses this money to compete against those very telecom companies that provide the ADC - for instance, by savagely cutting call rates. According to critics, the telecom regulator's stand also makes ADC ludicrous. "Some months ago, when it was clear that the gray marketing of calls was skyrocketing, TRAI put out a consultation paper on ADC and discussed the idea of charging ADC as a flat revenue share of all calls, as opposed to the current system of levying varying rates on different types of calls," says a telecom analyst.

This is why private telecom operators are now spreading themselves out across the globe. Reliance Infocomm has been setting up points of presence in New York and Los Angeles right from the time it started its international long-distance call services. The Tatas, after buying out the controlling stakes of VSNL (listed in the New York Stock Exchange) from the government, has spread out in the United States, the United Kingdom, Singapore and Hong Kong through subsidiary companies. By owning the other end of the network (collecting calls and sending them to India), they earn larger revenues. And since such calls do not originate from a third party, as laid down by the ADC rules, they are not bound to pay ADC to BSNL. But BSNL argues that even if a third party is absent in such call routing, since all private operators use the BSNL network for interconnecting to other operators, they are bound to pay the charge.

Even as the debate rages, TRAI has made it clear that it has no plans of removing ADC. But the regulator recently announced that it would announce a reworked package later this month, which would ensure "an increased fairness" by mandating that ADC is collected from calls from all access providers and not just those that involve fixed-line providers. It has also said that its revised ADC calculations will entail a "much lower quantum of ADC for private operators".

[Sanay 0]

MTNL too in ILD row with Reliance

RAJESHWARI ADAPPA THAKUR

TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ SATURDAY, OCTOBER 23, 2004 01:09:49 AM ]

MUMBAI: Mahanagar Telephone Nigam (MTNL) is embroiled in a dispute with private sector telecom major Reliance Infocomm over alleged illegal routing of international long distance (ILD) calls by the latter, to save on the access deficit charges (ADC) payable to the public sector telecom service provider.

The dispute with MTNL, which provides basic and cellular services in Delhi and Mumbai, comes after Reliance paid Rs 58 crore to Bharat Sanchar Nigam after similar allegations were made by the latter.

MTNL sources said that a notice had been issued to Reliance Info two weeks ago, asking them to pay up a sum of Rs 138 crore within 15 days or face disconnection.

“The deadline expired yesterday (October 22) and Reliance has not responded to the notice or made any payments,” sources said. The sources could not say whether MTNL will actually cut off Reliance Infocomm subscribers.

MTNL claims that Reliance owes it Rs 138 crore each in Mumbai and Delhi towards unpaid ADC on international calls that were routed illegally through the national long distance (NLD) route.

When contacted, a Reliance Infocomm spokesperson refused to comment. MTNL officials also declined to speak on record.

The allegation is that Reliance Infocomm had disguised ILD calls as NLD calls to save on ADC. ADC charges are paid to the two public sector telecom majors to enable them to subsidise rural and low income consumers.

If Reliance Infocomm does not take any action on Saturday, and if MTNL does disconnect its points of interconnection with the private telecom major, it will inconvenience both Reliance Info and MTNL subscribers in Mumbai and Delhi who will not be able to connect to each other.

“Reliance Info’s subscribers will not be able to connect to us and BSNL too,” MTNL sources pointed out.

Reliance Info had paid Rs 58 crore as an interim arrangement to BSNL earlier when the latter had threatened disconnection over the same issue. Reliance had earlier claimed that the total payments due to BSNL should not exceed Rs 30 crore as per the audited figures.

According to the current regulations, an ADC of Rs 4.30 per minute has to be paid to the fixed line operators for an incoming international call.

The department of telecom (DoT) had given Reliance Infocomm time till October 20 to explain why a penalty should not be imposed on them for violating the licence agreement.

What is interesting is that BSNL’s claim for illegal routing of calls across the whole country is expected to be in the region of Rs 200 crore while MTNL is claiming about Rs 276 crore for calls from the top two metros.

Sources said that the traffic from these two centres was significantly higher than that from any other city in the country.

Edited October 23, 2004 by Sanay

[Sanay 0]

MTNL to decide on disconnecting Reliance Infocomm calls today

TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ SUNDAY, OCTOBER 24, 2004 11:21:38 PM ]

MUMBAI: Mahanagar Telephone Nigam (MTNL) has decided to defer a final decision on whether to disconnect calls to and from Reliance Infocomm until Monday. Earlier, the public sector telecommunication company had threatened to snap all links with the private operator on October 23. An MTNL source said, “We have decided to wait till Monday; hence we did not disconnect today. But we are likely to disconnect the points of interconnection with Reliance Infocomm on Monday if we do not receive any payment by then.”

Nripendra Mishra, secretary, Department of Telecommunications (DoT), ruled out any intervention, saying that the issue is between the two operators. “It is up to them to decide between themselves,” he said.

MTNL’s proposed action against Reliance Infocomm follows the alleged illegal routing of international long distance calls as domestic long distance calls by the latter. Reliance Infocomm’s move was aimed at saving on the access deficit charge (ADC), according to sources. MTNL has claimed that Reliance Infocomm owes it a total Rs 276 crore for Mumbai and Delhi circles (Rs 138 crore each). The deadline for payment of ADC expired last Thursday.

Incidentally, the DoT had issued a notice to Reliance Infocomm, demanding an explanation as to why the latter should not be penalised for violating the licence agreement. Reliance Infocomm’s reply to DoT is being currently examined. “We are studying their reply and will decide on the future course of action in a few days,’’ said Mr Mishra.

Edited October 25, 2004 by Sanay

[dhayfule 0]

Hi Everybody,

I don’t know how many of you have come across this bug.

Recently I received a call from California (I am damn sure that it was from California!!!), but for my greatest shock I found that the number displayed on the screen belonged to a Reliance Customer located in the same city where I am.

On calling RIM Help desk I was told that SOMETIMES the SO CALLED NETWORK DEVICES don’t identify International Calls and forward a random local number.

Now that’s where the point of concern lies. In case if I receive an international emergency call from my relative located abroad, for whom I don’t have the number, how can I be aware of the incoming Calling Number for my future correspondence?

Apart from that if a business man in Mumbai (that’s where I am located) receives an extortion call from an International Telecom Network, and the number Flashed belongs to me, then one can understand how RIM Network Can Play a role in sending an Innocent Behind the Bars.

Now shall we still call it as RELIANCE, though we cant RELY on it???

Bye

Regards

[chandramauli 0]

yes,i noticed this too ...

my friends and releatives are in NZ and whenever they call me/us on our reliance FWP i get a number displayed of a AirTel Caller.... and when they call us on my/ur mobiles 'no name' is listed !!!

i keep wondering wht is all this ... but who cares as far as things are afforadable (the govt. & GSM have ****ed us badly in monetary term)

[tanveer 59]

I got a call on 10th sept from a friend in New Jersey nad it had Bombay reliance number displayed. That was long before the number change thing started, so i guess it is not related to the new nuberin scheme

[prawin 2]

I got a call on 10th sept from a friend in New Jersey nad it had Bombay reliance number displayed. That was long before the number change thing started, so i guess it is not related to the new nuberin scheme

16979[/snapback]

hi all

reliance is usig this technique to avoid access defit charge frm other networks , reliance has to pay rs 4 /min for international to other networks in india so to avoid this they r tampering caller id and changing them as local calls ,then the ADC becomes 40pisa /min

i think u guys got it right wat i say.

and one more thing international call through reliance network are full duplex ,in case of bsnl both parties can;t talk at a time the time gap is more for bsnl and other networks and very very less for reliance .

no need to complain abt it as it s for our best

my brother is calling frm us THROUGH RELIANCE INDIA call frm us and tariff is very less just 12cents /min and where as frm other serivice providers it is 17-18 cents/min

number routing is not a bug at all it is done by high level guys in reliance

-prawin

[Mantraway 0]

Please dont mislead!

Notthing like this is happ. Reliance is not routing ILD call as a local call. It's the rumour maked by BSNL.

I have received alot of calls from Nepal, Sri Lanka & Canada with perfect CLI numbers

Edited October 25, 2004 by sumit123

[Ganesh 0]

No Sumit123 , i regularly get calls from california and the CLI displays a mumbai number

[anujit 0]

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/896378.cms

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/887329.cms

Why would someone pay some much money to BSNL for nothing? Dhiru & sons remain a bunch of crooked thieves!

[webmaster1963 0]

the calls to india from usa are through internet.they are transfered to u through some india number.lots of other operators in usa are doing this business too.one card called " TAXI CARD" of US$10 also can be used from usa to india.withthis also u cant see usa number on indian phone......